>> we take you live now to portland, maine. we have democrat cynthia dill, independent transport an independent charlie summers. this was originally scheduled for last tuesday night but was canceled due to hurricane sandy. this will come as courtesy of local coverage on c-span2. moderating tonight's debate is shana mosque. >> good evening and welcome. for the next hours, you will hear from the candidates that want to represent maine. they are independent danny dalton, senator cynthia dill, independent transport and finally steve woods it is also an independent.

this debate is a partnership between aarp and the university of southern maine. i want to give you a quick word about the format tonight. a diverse mix of several different sources, including our editorial board as well as viewers. we want this debate to be truly interactive. we want to hear from you. paul is standing by moderating our facebook and twitter. >> we have good questions. this is a good chance to ask the candidates anything you want. you can go onto our website and take part in our discussion and we will ask the best questions during the next hour. the candidates will have one minute to ask the questions. with so many candidates, the coin toss is simply out of the question so we will be going in alphabetical order and starting with an opening statement from each candidate and we will begin with danny dalton.

>> you're not going to get a lot of details from this because questions are so short, but i urge you to go to everyone's website. mine is dalton sennett.com. i put a lot of detail into this and you should be able to find out how i come to my conclusions on the issues, and i hope you go to the other websites to find out what they have to say as well. maybe that is an indication. the reason i am running for the united states senate is because i spent 25 years in the federal government. those agencies comprise about 40% of our discretionary budget. they are not doing that and they should be looking at the constituents.

thank you very much. >> moderator: senator cynthia dill? dill: i am running because i want to make a difference. i believe america needs a new generation of leadership. what is wrong with the congress is extreme politics and in this particular race, by two major opponents represent the status quo. on one hand we have charlie summers and on the other hand we have angus king. today's "new york times" characterizes this race as karl rove versus michael bloomberg. what i am offering the people of the state of maine is to independence, someone who is not local and out-of-state money but only beholden to you and your family. so i look forward to tonight's discussion. we do need a new generation of leadership and i'm pleased to be in the race and i hope to have your support. >> moderator: thank you andrew ian dodge? dodge: those of you in maine

might recognize my name. we have been here since before maine was a state and before the revolution of the british. i am in this race because i believe the issues of liberty and freedom of individuals and the rights are being traveled on left and right, whether it is the local farmer selling raw milk. i have a touch of ethnic about me. i hope that we have an excellent discussion tonight. it has just been reported that we have the second worst place to earn a living in the country. i think it would be a shame if we sent the people that got us into that mess, sending one of them to washington dc. >> moderator: thank you.

king: olympia snowe left because she wanted to spend more time with her family, she left because she said the place and in function and she couldn't get anything done. she was utterly frustrated. i believe that we have to try to do something different in order to respond to that challenge, and that's why i am running for the united states senate as an independent. this makes a real difference in peoples people's lives. this isn't about processes. this is about solving the problems that the nation faces. for example, there was a bill before the senate that would have benefited veterans across the country and it was filibustered because the party in the senate -- they didn't want the president have a victory before the election. that is a terrible way to make

decisions. the concern should have been for the veterans and not for the politics. >> moderator: thank you. summers: we are spending a trillion dollars a year year more than we take in and that is simply unsustainable. i want to go to washington to lead and i want to lead the fight to cut spending and to reduce regulation and keep taxes low, so that businesses can expand and people can get jobs and they can feed their families and pay their mortgage and send their kids to school. i think that the choice we have to make on november 6 is very clear. you can choose someone who took a $200 million surplus, increases spending by 50% and let us with the highest tax burden in the country, or you can choose me. i would like to go to washington and lead the fight to reduce

spending and reduce regulation and do things to grow this economy, and i would appreciate your vote. >> moderator: steve woods? woods: i'm a businessman and chairman of my local town council. this campaign and other campaigns bother me. cynthia, i am tired of your constant criticism of old wealthy white men. i think it is undignified for a u.s. senate candidate. charlie, i'm tired of your gross distortion of truth in regard to angus king come and i'm tired of your tv commercials ruining all my favorite shows on abc. i get it. 1.3 million. we both think that angus is responsible for terrible things. that and everything else. but as a citizen of maine, i ask you stop this for the next hour.

i would like to talk about the issues. i pledge to give to check for $5000 each to the main surety of your choice. this is an opportunity to prove that you put maine verse. >> moderator: not know about our candidates, we're going to move into her questions. there are a lot of issues. again, you're free to submit a question of your own that are website or facebook or twitter. one in five americans approve of the job that the congress is doing. it is the lowest approval rating in the reason that most of you are here, mostly because he is tired of the lack of bipartisanship in washington. here's how she describes the problem.

>> these are american issues. and i think that is very important to look at in the questions rather than the stalemate and biting each other. you abandon an effort to resolve the issue. >> moderator: it is the my way or the highway that has disillusioned a lot of voters who are concerned that nothing is getting done in washington. they want to know what you're going to do about it. it was the number one question that we got. >> what we do to show the voters that you can work together and be bipartisan? how are you going to break the gridlock in washington. to me, that is one of the big issues facing all of us right now. >> moderator: each one of you, you have said that you are not the career politician, an outsider, you're not an independent, shaking things up

in washington, et cetera. why should they believe what they are our same? secretary, we will start with you. >> these are serious issues that will bother country we do nothing about it. summers: the time has come for partisanship to fall to the wayside. we have to do that. we have to be willing to move this country forward and we have to be willing to agree with people when they have a good idea. that is the key component. they have sent very important people like olympia snowe, to congress. they feel it is very important

to move the process forward. that is the approach that i will take him and that is the approach that i think will be successful. >> moderator: steve woods? woods: over a two-year period, if you are a republican that only cares about that, you should vote for charlie summers. i guarantee that he will vote 100% of the time along party lines. cynthia gill will vote 100% along party lines. to quote abraham lincoln, we must vote for the candidate at all levels, local, state, federal. those that serve the common good and do not fall to the seductive voices of fear and armed with only the letters tran-seven to

imus. we must put maine and country first. >> moderator: andrew ian dodge? dodge: i want to smack a few heads together and get things done. i am not fooled and harry reid or whoever leads the republicans in the senate. i can act on my own behalf and get together with people who agree with me on certain issues. i'm not going to be threatened with not getting any donations are being invited to the best parties. if i don't care about that, that is good. all i care if the is the people of maine. i will be there as your representative and your senator. not anybody else. i am a golden anybody. >> moderator: senator cynthia dill? dill: i decided to run against

the country headed in the wrong direction. i'm proud to be a democrat and i support the democratic platform and what it stands for. i'm proud of the fact that democrats brought this country's social security and medicare in a portable care act. they're really good things that have been done by democrats. but i am not driven by ideology. in fact, nothing in the record suggests that i am ideologue or a partisan. i sponsored legislation that was a bipartisan effort. 1100 miles of fiber optic cable. i worked with the governor, republicans and democrats. i'm in this race because i want to make a difference and i will put the interest of maine's people and to suggest that because you have values you belong to a team, they somehow don't care about people is just really outrageous.

obviously, as you can see from tonight's debate, it doesn't really mean anything other than you don't have a group. >> moderator: we have to stop right there. danny dalton? dalton: dalton: that is why i got all the signatures myself. i talked to the people, 6000 people. what was said was the two-party system is broke and we are putting money ahead of values when it comes to our elected officials. parties are controlled by lobbyist groups such as the u.s. chamber of commerce. places like health care and also immigration reform in this idea that senator snowe is just walking away because she

couldn't handle the bitterness and the politics is disingenuous. all these issues that we are talking about, all of these issues with tax reform and social security, they have all been on the table for a long time. what should be happening is that we should be holding them accountable. >> moderator: we will have to wrap it up right now. angus king? king: this is a common but i've heard it the last eight months. they say why can't they talk to each other or copper mines. why can't they just follow common sense. but not only is it aggravating, it was just a study done about a month ago by the federal reserve bank of san francisco that said that this bickering in congress is actually costing us jobs. it is costing the economy. they estimate that unemployment would be 2% lawyer for one of the best. i am in us for this for this very reason. it is what i live as an independent governor. i had worked with both sides and i didn't have a party in the

legislature. every tuesday morning we had breakfast with republicans and democratic leaders and effort to bring them together to start talking about the issue. sometimes i work more closely with democrats and sometimes of the republicans. but the whole thing was an exercise in parties work together successfully on behalf of the people of maine. i don't have any magic formula, but i think we have to try. >> moderator: let's move onto our next question. economy is improving a little bit, but not fast enough. maine's unemployment came in at about 7.6%. slightly up from a year ago. right now we have a question from one of the viewers. >> this comes from our website. the livewire section. it seems as though our candidates tout small-business experience. how many coworkers do currently employ? do cover their health care?

>> at having created jobs at supper myself. i have provided training and we are working on policies that will help his government create an environment for small business. i come from a long line of small business. i phoned a owned a small business and then whopper for many years. it doesn't necessarily translate into good government. i think what we need are people and small businesses to grow and prosper and to help families get through this economy.

the disparity of income is the biggest problem and what my two major opponents offers more of the same. >> moderator: i want to throw some questions out. >> i'm not small-business owner. i've never said i was that i was self-employed, and a freelance writer. of course, if you are political, like i am when you run for senate, you are suddenly no longer employed in that way. not only have i not created jobs, have actually cost myself a job for office. so one question, i don't have a very good record. >> i will follow up with mr. gone. dalton: we have looked at government services being separate. the u.s. senate is a job.

everyone talks about jobs. in the abstract, i will do this amount. the secretary talked about working in the hotel, which is fine. i do employ close to 100 people and they do offer health care benefits and i do own my company is which offers preventative health care across the country. >> moderator: could you provide numbers on that? dalton: my daughter who is 21 benefits from the affordable care act. businesses are important. business experience is relevant as opposed to people outside talking about this.

woods: this is very important in the state of maine. we subcontract businesses in the state and also the problem comes back to how you develop more small-business within maine. governor lepage came up with a great idea which is the corporate income tax. we know what the chinese are manufacturing and business organizations over there. one of the things that has a drawback for our small-business is the fact that we have a corporate income tax that is applied toward exports and makes us uncompetitive globally. >> moderator: danny dalton? dalton: and last for five years, i have not had that opportunity.

certainly, small businesses managing in portland, and later other small businesses in biddeford, we did not offer health insurance, but we did employ people. >> moderator: angus king's people are my concern is bringing $5 million worth of negative advertising in the state. i assume that the sports a lot of jobs in the tv industry. in the campaign we have about 10 to 12 people. i'm proud to say that even though it is a short-term campaign experience, we do offer health care to the people working in the campaign. i am also on the board of hancock longer. all main companies, hoping to maintain those jobs, all of those companies. >> moderator: moving onto the next question. the median household income is

$46,933 in 200,000 we think is the primary issue facing the middle class and maine come and how do you address it immediately. we are looking for specifics are. andrew ian dodge. dodge: it is hard to make ends meet in maine. we are doing very poorly enough. one of our biggest problems is that we export all of our people. people get out of college, but can't find jobs there, some so they leave. there is that whole thing of maine line. it's not here to increase our businesses or the size of businesses, they do it elsewhere after they leave. >> moderator: how would you fix it?

dalton: we need to do everything we can. >> moderator: cynthia dill? dill: i don't think there is a direct correlation between the abilities of the public and your track record in terms of numbers and businesses. but to address the question, two thirds of united states senate are millionaires. the bush tax cuts are in large part because of the debt and deficit. people succumbing to insatiable greed is what led to the fate of so many families. i believe there is a direct correlation between their are only 17 women in the united states senate and 20% of women live in poverty. i believe there is a lot that is captured by big money and the fact that one in five children are without health care.

>> moderator: steve woods? woods: beginning an answer is education. we have a large infrastructure here in maine. maine is the size of many other states combined. we have a little economic engine. it is nobody's fault. it is the way that state is laid out. the answer is for us to continue. years ago, people competed in commerce and we had cars and air transportation. we are now in the global marketplace. i was just in california and we need to compete across the country that involves investment technology and it starts in grades k-12. talk about jobs for people in their 20s and 30s, we don't

focus on being more competitive or more grants. >> moderator: cohead 3 >> moderator: cohead >> it is due to the fact that our government hasn't been able to work together like everyone said. we are not putting in place specific things. it is equitably distributed. when i want to do is make sure that we have comprehensive tax reforms. and the evidence of benghazi.

>> moderator: let's move onto the next question. >> i have campaigned with people all over the state. i think the best thing we can do is get government off of businesses back so that they understand that if they have a tax system that is fair and they can plan five or 10 years down the road in terms of buying equipment and hiring people, the best thing that they can do is get government out of the way to reduce relations and cut spending so that the economy can grow and people can have jobs to feed their families. >> moderator: over the past month we have seen gas prices fall. four years ago, there was a state record.

$4.14 a gallon. the question is what is the best in the short-term and long-term to find a solution? >> the best way to get off at will is quickly and as fast as we can, we'll is a worldwide commodity with demand it is going to continue to grow, particularly in places like china and india. the sooner we can have substitute fuels and not think for the immediate future, anyway, as long as we are careful about how this is extracted and it can be extracted safely, it can be an enormous advantage. and we can use it and i was on a bus today. it was powered by natural gas. we can use it to power electric vehicles. at the same time, there should be a parallel track developing renewables to be either when the gas runs out or the demand increases to the point for the price goes up. but right now, to powerful your vehicle and natural gas is about equivalent of $2 per gallon, and

it will be the same for home heating. getting off of oil should be number one priority and we are finally in a position to do it, and this this is only has only come first and last for five years. >> moderator: cynthia dill? dill: this is a challenge to any family that is trying to get to the grocery store gets work. i do support the president's fuel efficiency standards that will lead to automobiles or rely on less fuel, which will cost less money eventually. i'm also the only candidate in the race that opposes the keystone pipeline. i don't believe that that is not going to further the problem. i also opposed hunter prechter. i recognize domestic production of gas or something after wound and i support the president's policies that have led to the highest domestic production in decades, but i agree, we have to put devoted towards renewable energy. i think that we have solar power

that has to be explored and energy efficiency is really the key. we have to conserve and become more efficient when it comes to our use of energy and fuel, and that will lead to less reliance on gas and while and less hydrocarbons in the atmosphere and ultimately, less money spent. >> moderator: i'm going to go next to charlie and then we will wrap it up. summers: when someone works in the woods or the water, what they want to be able to do is get back and forth to work in an expensive way. i think we have a moral responsibility in this country to look for energy resources here. whether and whether you're talking about oil or gas or coal, nuclear power, we have to have in all of the above strategy. ten years ago in the united states senate, they had a debate and they said if we start drilling now, it will take 10 years before that will becomes in our fuel system.

that would've been done and we would've had it here today that was done 10 years ago. we have a responsibility. we should be drilling for oil here in this country and we should be looking at every alternative that we have. i understand full well what that means. it is not an issue of politics or policy or ideology. it is an issue about survival of illustration. we have finite resources. at some point we are running out. they predict different years. but this is not about what is at the pump. ..

>> access to affordable care is what i like, and what's wrong with the -- what happened here was the two parties, again, democrats and republicans, who i hope i replace with more independents so they are held accountable for being in the pockets of the major lobbyists, they don't come to complete reform when it comes to the major issues.

to allow major lobby groups like big pharmaceuticals, the u.s. chamber of commerce, ama, and even aarp to get in the room and force them to make requirements that aren't for the best interest of the people, the reason we have a mandate was because that was force down their throat. the reason we don't have a public option, which would have allowed people to not have a mandate and have a public insurance provider was because of the different pharmaceutical and big lobbyist groups everyone's taking money from. we have to stop that. >> moderator: sorry, going to move on. governor king, you want to answer the question? king: i support the affordable care act. it's a huge mistake to repeal it. it's providing benefits to people here in maine. i was talking to one covered

under his parent's health insurance, 23-year-olds old, and then he also was born in a tumor in his brain, non-cancerous, but that's a pre-existing condition, and he wouldn't be able to have health care the rest of his life if not for the rules of the affordable care act. it's an important step forward. it's not the whole answer. it does not cut medicare benefits, takes money from providers and insurance companies under medicare, but reallocates that into the system. the aarp there on your screen has confirmed that. they wouldn't support it if it took money from seniors. the next issue is cost, and the affordable care act has pilot programs, several of which are near in maine going to, i believe, substantially bring down costs. i believe that's an important law. >> moderator: charlie, do you disagree? >> i do, you know, for an important reason.

the affordable health care agent is the most misnamed thing i've heard. there's nothing affordable about it. this country is $16 frl in debt, and we're talking about spending 2.6 trillion dollars, and where's that money coming from? this is another big government solution that will cut $616 billion out of medicare. >> moderator: is that what you don't like is the money -- summers: the specifics from that and what it cuts from medicare, and it puts another government bureaucracy in place, and i think these projected savings, we've seen government projections before. in 1964, when they passed medicare and medicaid, they projected it cost $9 billion, but it was more. we have to allow individuals to go across state lines, purchase health insurance like they purchase homeowner insurance, and another less expensive

option is to allow them to deduct it from the federal income taxes like home mortgage interests. >> moderator: i have to wrap you up on that. speaking about aarp as well talking on social security. talk about that issue. for millions of americans -- >> [inaudible] >> moderator: feel free to interrupt each other or chime in. we're half way done, and we won't get to half the questions. >> i wanted to thank the democrats for the affordable care act, and children can someday on the policies until they are 26, there's no caps on benefits, can't be discriminated against because the preexisting condition. women are not considered a preexisting condition because of the gender. there's preventative mammograms, screenings, and seniors get affordable drugs. the affordable care act is good. thank the democrats for it. >> moderator: mr. dodge? dodge: since, again, what the democrats want is a nationalize

your health care, they want pure karats running your health, and that's the ultimate goal, and obamacare is just the first step, and i'm against obamacare. any american who wants to decide what their own health care is should be against it too. >> moderator: mr. woods, go ahead. woods: thank you. i own a health and wellness company. preexisting conditions important in covering people under 26. i think that when you talk about politeizing this, we lose sight. we're not like britain or canada. our philosophy, our dna, we have a moral imperative to care for people from prenatal to seniors. we don't need legislative authority. i support the agent because it's the best first step in decades, but it's who we are as americans that we take care of people when they are ill. we do not turn people away at

hospitals. we don't deny people coverage. all the affordable care act does is make sure we can identify and people pay their fair share. i support it. thank you. >> moderator: mr. woods, thank you. 300,000 people right here in maine, social security is more than a retirement benefit, but a safety net. in maine, nonpartisan aarp notes one-third of those beneficiaries, 65 and older, rely on social security as their entire income. that's it. the average monthly benefit is $1065. tell us about the plan for social security, not only for today's seniors, but for future generations. senator dill? dill: thank you. social securityñ&r is important. i have a 94-year-old grandmother living on social security. i know some people in maine and america rely on it. thank the democrats for social security. what i would do to shore up the finances for social security is raise the income cap. currently, it's $110,000 or

thereabouts. we could shore up financial stability, we can also tax salary reduction plans. we can also gradually increase over 20 years the contributions that people make into the system. currently, employees and employers contribute, it's a social insurance program, it's not an entitlement program, and if we all contribute more, the program can be sound for future generations. it's critically important, not just for seniors, but it's important for women because they contribute less because of making less in wages. they often take years out of the work force to raise children, live longer, and have complicated diseases at the end of their life. social security is something i plan to protect and strengthen. summers: i will not support any legislation cutting social security benefits for people who are currently in the system. i do not support privatization of social security. i'll tell you why.

fifteen years ago when i lost my first wife, my children, 8 and 11 at the time, got social security benefits. we could exist and raise children because of social security. it's important. i think those who paid into it and are in the system need to be protected. now, going forward, i think younger people as they come into the system, they may have to retire at a later date, and i think that more wealthy people like governor king may not be able to get as much of the benefit. it's important to note we have to protect it for people on the system right now. >> moderator: governor king? king: i think it's important to understand how important it is in maine. if social security wasn't present, 8% of the seniors in maine who are now in poverty, that number jumps to 49%. it's absolutely essential. i'm dead against privatization now or in the future. i think it would destroy the program. it shouldn't be means tested.

it's something people have paid into and earned. social security is not in serious ac rare yal trouble. we can raise the cap on where the tax applies and 40 years from now, perhaps, increase the retirement age. the fixes to social security are not that radical. medicare is in much more serious financial condition, and often, nose two get mixed up, but social security is in relatively good shape. any effort to privatize it or voucherrize it or i think else is a huge mistake. >> moderator: okay, mr. dalton? >> dalton: the reason it's in bad shape because the two-party system didn't agent on the issue 40 years ago. we can blame the two-party system. those who don't for an independent here, don't complain to me about the two-party system again, democrats or republicans. like they said, it's not a very

big problem to fix. congressional budget office says .6% of the gdp. whether or not you call it an entitlement or not, if you say i've earned it, then, believe me, when it comes time for me to collect it, i want it, i earned, okay? entitlement or not, whatever you call it, i want my money when i'm 65. to put it on the backs of the younger people right now doesn't make sense when you can adjust it by 2% over 20 year, and that solves the short fall. for people 55 and older, by the time i'm 65, if i add 2% at least for ten years i put into it in solving the problem. >> moderator: right now, we're going to a reporter who has a question for the candidates from a viewer. >> from the facebook page from sharon morford dudley. did the politics support if a bill doesn't pass, they don't

get paid? dalton: i do support that. i think that everyone's talked about the two-party system. everyone's talked about what's wrong with government. i like to make a comment on that. i think that what's really wrong is a broader sense of the decay of democracy. we're electing people that are making bad decisions for us whether it's handling debt, whether it's how we handle issues like budgets that keeps going on the debt to china. the answer is, for people to take ownership of the democracy, the answer for all of these problems, i believe, does not exist at these two tape of tables. there's fine men and women here that can be -- that can be instruments for some of the solutions, but people involved, viewers tonight, need to be more involvedded, need to demand, not just here, but across the state, local, town. that's where the answers are.

yes, i do think it's ridiculous that we have people in government not making decisions, but, yet, they collect a paycheck when others suffer. >> moderator: no budget, no pay. who is for it? >> let me say they're all millionaires, who cares. >> what's the point? >> yeah, what's the point? the idea is that, again, the two parties supposed to be doing their job, and the way to stop them from not doing their job and to be in the pockets of the lobbyists and powerful interests and special interest groups is by even independents like steve woods or nip else that hold them accountable for not doing their job and making sure that we're not rewarding incompetence and bad behavior. the two-party system, too big to fail put in place, insuring through the media they get the attention, other candidates here are not addressed and the issues are not addressed. they're in a whole campaign.

glsm p >> -- >> moderator: let's go to dill. dill: keep in mind, the very group proposing and supporting that is the same group providing millions of dollars to the king campaign, another super pac -- king: that's not true. no labels is not a super pac. they are contributing nothing to the campaign. dill: those on the board of directors writing checks to the king campaign. king: that's not true either. dill: it was reported tonight. the fact that it's a a party system is ridiculous. sure, no budget, no pay. the problem -- dalton said they are all millionaires. need people in the senate who are aware of what it costs to pay a family, those in touch with the challenges of ordinary people who know there will be consquences.

we need a new generation of leadership. >> moderator: medicare provides hospital and prescription drug coverage for millions of americans include 270,000 in maine. we pay to it with the promise or coverage when we retire. what's your plan for current and future senors. >> we have to make sure that medicare is protected for those people who have paid into it on the system right now. i think the first thing that we have to do is repeal obamacare because it cuts $716 billion. i met with health care administers across maine who agree it costs money. there's supposed promised savings. that's like projected savings from angus king windmills. that's not going to happen. we have to deal with the here, now, and today and protect medicare ensuring our seniors have that ability to benefit from the program, and the first thing to do is repeal the president's health care plan. >> moderator: mr. king, you

were mentioned. king: seems to be the way it goes. first thing on medicare is no vouchers. that's the -- that's the ryan plan in the budget that congressman ryan got through the house of representatives. it's a to turn it into a voucher program where they get a voucher and go out and shop and buy insurance. that's a terrible idea, dead against it, and i would oppose it as firmly as i could. the issue with medicare is the same with the issue with anthem or any other payment mechanism. hospital and medical costs are going up faster than inflation. what we have to do is figure out a different payment mechanism which we're working on here in maine under the affordable care act called accountable care organizations. there's one in portland through maine health, one in eastern maine, one in louistown, and one in augusta. we're paying for health, prevention, and primary care rather than paying procedures. that's the secret we have to go to, and it's happening right now

in maps, and we're already seeing results. i talked to the directer of the hospital at eastern maine seeing results from that way of handling health care to bring the costs down, and that's the way we'll save medicare. >> moderator: all right. mr. woods? woods: first of all, there's a $10,000 wrt of check -- worth of checks there from the pledge that didn't come through. >> a pledge of anyone but you. keep your money, thanks. woods: thank you. >> you're welcome. woods: the issue is we have a one side of the equation, what represents health care. we have medicine, treatment, institutions. on the other side, there's patients. every single american and every single mainer is a patient from prenatal care to senior care. the issue, i believe, is in the 42%, in the middle, the transactional cost, administrative costs. we can do better. we should do better, but not on the backs of the most vulnerable mainers and americans.

if we have the will to do what we need to do in terms of health care reform, we can make it more efficient, but we shouldn't do it with senior people who are the most vulnerable americans. >> a short point. cut costs hugely by cutting the cost of bringing drugs to market. the fda and the drug administration make it so expensive that great products that could help lots of people are not brought to market because small companies are not getting the -- can't afford to get them approved. that's the way to bring down drug costs. take big farm -- pharm out of the equation. >> moderator: less than 12 minutes. >> i want to remind people thank democrats for medicare. if you like it, i agree with what angus said, we can go a long way in stabilizing medicare by redoing part d, allowing medicare to negotiate prescription drugs. i go further suggesting we have medicare for all.

it's an excellent program. it needs to be reigned in, and we have to make changes. it's important, again, thank your democratic party for that. >> i just want to address medicare quick. glsm that's fine. >> you can't address medicare unless there's comprehensionive tax reform, and we have to find a way to actually have tax reform that pays for these things that we want the government to pay for, and everyone has to be involved with paying for that, and the way to do is that to have a sales tax. >> moderator: super pacs, outside groups spending millions of dollars to influence the race independently of your campaigns without accountability. your campaigns are not paying for the commercials we see on the air waves. is this acceptable? if your answer is no, tell me how you would change it. starting with you, mr. dalton. dalton: the best way to have the representative you want, not controlled or helped by big money in politics and special interests and all the pressures

that come from that and the big lobby groups is to make sure that you're voting for a candidate that doesn't want to accept that money. i don't accept any money from anyone. i sit here at the table with everyone else. go to my website, i explain all my issues in complete detail. i dare say that nobody else here at the table has put as much effort into their website, which everyone has access to, find out how i came to conclusions on my issues, and the information i have there, and if you want to respond to me and help me decide what's the best thing for this country, that's the best way to do it. i would like to know it from the people, not having special interests, pacs, and super pacs pay the way. if you want to take the money, go for it. it's up to the people to decide who to vote for. >> moderator: mr. king? king: the super pac business is awful. i've been a beneficiary, but we have to end it.

the first thing, there's a bill in the congress called the disclose act so we know where the money is coming from. one of the problems now is there's no -- we have no idea where all the money is coming from for all the ads, and that is a specific thing the legislature can do, the congress can do. the next step, i'm afraid, may be a constitutional amendment because the supreme court ruled that money is speech and corporations are people, and if that's what the supreme court said, then the animal way to change that is either to change the supreme court or change the constitution. i think this pac money is ridiculous. this is a flier i got today or yesterday in the mail promoting dill saying what a bad guy -- says i'm a supporter of george w. bush. i campaigned for john kerry in twawr, but it comes to me that safe nation, pac, 57 street, georgia. who is this? it's a couple republican

operatives in atlanta who are sending a misleading flier to democrats in maine trying to convince them to vote for cynthia dill. the whole thing is ridiculous. i think the rule ought to be only residents of the place where you are running can contribute. if you run for the u.s. senate in maine, only maine people can contribute. i would live with that system in a minute. >> the founder principle was representation. that's leading to the birth ofñr our country. it was not about corporations. it was not about rove. it was about representation. one of the most precious freedoms that was free speech. since the unit, terrible decision. super pacs bad, election reform. we need that. people talk about big government being bad. my experience in terms of the campaign is it's the political and industrial complex that's just insidious both here in maine and nationalliment i think we have to get back to the

principle that when people want to run for office, whether it's the six candidates here tonight, local office, county, state, they should be able to have a straight dialogue with the elector rat and say vote for me. this is what i stand for. people shouldn't say don't vote for angus king, don't vote for steve. that's not, i think, a bit rooted in the democracy. >> what we're talking about is free speech in this country, and do i like some of the ads i see? i'm sure the people don't like them either, but the fact of the matter is that they -- we get ourselves wrapped around the axel in the issue. what we should be focused on is doing things to cut spending in the country, doing things to get regulations undercontrol, growing our economy. the average person in the state of maine, people who work with hands for a living, wonder how to pay their mortgage, how to pay their taxes, and send the taxes to the university of maps. that's what we should discuss. not somebody from georgia

sending whatever in. we stand on the records. mine's been examined, everyone else's here has been examined. you have to deal with it. it's a serious job going after right now, and there's going to be very difficult decisions that have to be made, and to sit here and wring our hands and cry about who says what about who object playground, that demeans the process. >> nobody's crying. you're the head of elections. you're the secretary of state. free speech? it's not. billionaires control the election. it's not free speech. >> he's whining again. tired of it. talk about people's jobs, ability to feed your families, not whether or not steve is offend ped. >> moderator: moving on to taxes now because that had create lively conversations as well. there's americans who don't believe the tax burden is fairly distributed. for example, investment income tax at a lower rate than people earn at their jobs. what do you think is a fair percentage of the income to pay in taxes.

five minutes left. we want everybody to answer and move along. >> corporations, individuals, across the board, 15% flat tax. no more. that's the way to keep us competitive, and i'm against progressive taxation because it's unfair an anti-american. >> moderator: mr. dalton, go ahead. >> dalton: the income tax system is dysfunctional. we need a different tax system. sales tax or fair tax is the way to go. corporate income tax erased, replaced by a sales tax, corporate income tax is something none of the other countries have, and that makes us uncompetitive globally. look at the website, thank you. >> moderator: cynthia dill >> dill: needs reformation. i'm the only one who supports president obama's proposal not to extend bush tax cuts for families making above $250,000. stop giving subsidies to corporations who don't need it. we have to impose a financial transaction tax on very small

tax on stock trades to the people responsible for the collapse of our economy chip in. i do believe that we need to lower corporate income tax rates, stabilize the base, ensuring it's fair. pay your fair share. it's time that the super wealthy, the corporations pay more. i agree with warren buffet. >> moderator: three minutes. secretary summers? summers: doing things that make sure the taxes are as low as they can be in the country because by doing that, we increase the number of people who are paying taxes because they can get jobs. you know, if we're not selling a product as a company, we don't go out and raise the prices. what we do is figure out why we are not selling the product, lower the price, and work on volume. we can want tax our way out of this -- we cannot tax our way out of this situation. king made a push in the campaign, the central theme, of raising taxes. that's the worst thing to do, even president obama two years ago advocated extending the bush tax cuts because that's a wet

blanket on the economy. we have to keep taxes low, expand job opportunity. >> moderator: governor king? king: nobodiments -- nobody wants to raise taxes. the situation with the debt, though, is one that we have to look at revenues as well as cuts. impossible to do it otherwise. i'm engaged with a projectx called the simpson bawls, a bipartisan effort led by alan simpson of wyoming, and bowles of south carolina. they propose cutting tax rates, eliminating loopholes, deductions, and exemptions, and reducing rates, but taking 8% of the revenues that are generated by that process, and putting that gex p against the debt. that's proven, responsible, and nobody wants to raise taxes, but we have to talk seriously about this, and some frame work like simpson bowles or the other plans out there on a bipartisan basis, i think, are going to be necessary to solve this problem.

i think what we'll end up with is a fair tax system and lower rates across the board and more fairly distributed amongst our people. >> moderator: mr. woods? woods: it's common sense, math, there has to be revenue and cuts. i appreciate, again, secretary summers talking on the issue, but for somebody who signed the grover pledge, he's not allowed to talk about revenue, even if he believes it in the heart, showed him a spreadsheet showing it's just math. charlie said, no, i can't do it. i signed a pledge. >> [inaudible] >> if i could finish here, cynthia. we can talk about that if that's a question. there has to be tax reform. corporate tax rates should be adjusted, but i think the bush tax cuts for the wealthy should be looked at and should be removed. part of it has to do with sacrifice.

what very few people talk about is america's in a crisis. there's people suffering now. somebody in the highest tax bracket, i support paying more taxes, not because i want to or i couldn't use the money or it wouldn't be, you know, personal advantageous. we have to stop candorring to people saying revenue can't be done. >> moderator: all right. thank you very much. before we go, stay with news 8 and wmtw.com for continuing coverage of all of these campaigns as we head into election day, just a few days away, tuesday, november 6th, and, of course, join us on that night for special eleeçez coverage both on air and online, wmtw.com. i'd like to thank all the candidates. we got in a lot of questions. thank you for bearing with me, and our co-sponsors, aarp, and university of southern maine. get out, vote, obviously, to everybody out there, it's your civic duty. for all of you at home, thank you for watching as well, and for all of those